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White Gates Beadle residence potentially saved

Exchange knowledge and photos of your Beadle Home, materials, suppliers, solutions, joys and special challenges of living in a Beadle.

Moderators: matthew, PixelPixie

Postby matthew on Wed May 02, 2007 8:16 am

i love the idea of the oval shadows.

i have not seen oval perf before. I suspect you would have to get it cut with a waterjet or laser. If it was aluminum i have a couple of contacts with CNC routers...
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Postby Funktional Design on Wed May 02, 2007 8:36 am

I found a company that supplies it. I've been searching for it FOREVER! I finally happened across it recently.

It is punched sheet. This company makes their own tooling, so for a big enough job you could have pretty much any shape punched out.
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Postby jasonasteele on Wed May 02, 2007 5:59 pm

Updated the model. The site is getting a bit tight on the east side. I've got to check the zoning ordinances. The terrain model doesn't take the wash into account either.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8XHSpKr2fDc

The estimate I projected for this entire build is as follows:
Original House restoration: 2,400 SF $100/SF_______= $240,000
New Casita Construction: 900 SF $150/SF__________= $135,000
Site work, Pool, Landscaping and Utilities___________= $100,000
GRAND TOTAL:_______________________________= $475,000
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Postby meagen on Wed May 02, 2007 8:26 pm

Funktional - have you tried McNichols? http://www.mcnichols.com/
They have a warehouse here and ship in regularly if it's not in Phx stock.
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Postby matthew on Wed May 02, 2007 8:36 pm

THERE IS A MCNICHOLS WAREHOUSE HERE? DAMN I LOVE PHOENIX ABOUT 11% MORE AS OF THIS MOMENT!
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Postby Funktional Design on Thu May 03, 2007 12:29 am

meagen wrote:Funktional - have you tried McNichols? http://www.mcnichols.com/
They have a warehouse here and ship in regularly if it's not in Phx stock.


Yeah, I was at there warehouse last week picking up some wire mesh. They do have decorative perf, but not like this other place.
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Postby Funktional Design on Thu May 03, 2007 12:32 am

matthew wrote:THERE IS A MCNICHOLS WAREHOUSE HERE? DAMN I LOVE PHOENIX ABOUT 11% MORE AS OF THIS MOMENT!


There is. It's out on like 54th ave and Latham. Don't get too excited though. They only stock basic wire meshes, grates, and perf. They don't stock any of their decorative meshes and perfs.

When you buy perf steel and wire mesh anywhere in the valley, there is a good chance it came through McNichols. They supply almost everyone, including IMS.
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Well good luck with that...

Postby jrichard on Mon May 07, 2007 5:52 pm

I think its great what you are attempting to do, and salute your enthusiasm. If they would be helpful I have cad files, as builts, and photographs of the existing building, and the original interiors. (Original as they were, there had been successive renovations and "updates" to the interior prior to the demolition)

I have all this stuff because I had designed no less than three full designs for the restoration and expansion of this house. One of which was a state and western mountain region AIA honor award winning design for a steel truss house that sat between the carport and main house and spanned the arroyo to the back part of the site. All out of corten steel with sliding panels of perforated steel, it was a bold scheme that restored the existing house largely to it's original condition, the only intervention being a glass bridge that penetrated a removed panel on the west side of the house. The carport was glazed in as a freestanding studio. It was pretty cool. We actually finished most of the construction documents and engineering.

Then the neighbors started. Half of them are lawyers, and promised that anything done to the house will trigger a lawsuit. I've worked in some pretty contentious settings, this was about the worst I've seen. Unfortunately the house sits forward of the required setback, by about 10' therefore just about anything you do requires a varience for the original structure. That requries the neighbors agreement, and that is still not going to keep a nusance lawsuit from being filed.

We did two other designs that laid a block to the rear of the existing house, same deal, at some point you are going to affect a neighbors view and here you go again. Will Bruder was looking at a pretty cool idea as well of an egg shaped layout addition to the rear.

I feel sorry for the little house, it's sort of like a child caught in the middle of a bitter divorce. You can take a look to the left, right and behind the site to see what the neighbors really think of beadle, each one has been morphed onto, taco'ed or flat out torn down. I hate to say it but sometimes I think the best thing may be to let it go.

Anyway I hope something positive can be made of it.
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Postby MrX on Mon May 07, 2007 6:04 pm

wow. You have been down this road then. The cads and asbuilts etc would be very helpful.

Now I am more worried than I was already. I don't know if the owner has the resources to fight the good fight, but the house is still there, so I am not going to give up yet.
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Postby JC on Mon May 07, 2007 9:24 pm

Thanks jrichard-
Do send MrX the plans I am certain they would be helpful.
If you need help posting them I can aid with that, just email them my way.
I don't know about anyone else- but I had no idea there was ever plans to improve the structure.
We may need to toss jrichard in to the mix of talent!

As for the neighbors- I am sorry to use the offensive term- but they can fuck off.

They have two choices- work towards a good restoration/ addition that improves the appeal of the neighborhood, or they can fight things and have the eyesore that is currently there left in tact as it is.

If it helps, I am certain that as a community, we, Modern Phoenix can bark very loud.
Our bark carries a long way.
Would it be beneficial to start a "Save White Gates" petition?
I can probably gather a few hundred signatures myself.

How do all of these McMansion tear downs get approval under this mentality?

I imagine good renderings would help ease the concerns of the neighbors....
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Postby PixelPixie on Mon May 07, 2007 9:59 pm

Michael P. Johnson told me today that he has worked with the 3 previous owners on plans as well. Are you guys all part of some sort of team of superheroes? ;-)

There is a possibility that White Gates will be entered as one of the AZ Preservation Foundation's Top Ten Endnagered Properties. Will know more in a day or so if it is eligible and the owner does not mind. This will attract the support and media attention thru the APF as well as give the neighbors something to realize that we will not just roll over and take it.
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Postby modeddie on Mon May 07, 2007 11:45 pm

This is a fight worth fighting. I encourage all modern phoenicians to support it.

________
A spectre is haunting Phoenix, the spectre of modernism....
Modernists of Phoenix, Unite!
Last edited by modeddie on Thu Feb 21, 2008 11:34 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby roma on Thu May 10, 2007 9:18 pm

This is such an amazing house and concept. If only the neighbors will put down the swords. I've often wondered about moving the house to an infill location given the neighborhood resistance. The passion and collaborative efforts are so cool. when it's time for kitchens, I'd love to collaborate with the locaal architects/designers and designers from Scavolini Milan.

:D
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Postby pedrolobo on Fri May 18, 2007 12:08 am

If the house really and truly did have to go, I'd be willing to chip in the first $100 to rent a helicopter that could then be used to drop the little gem onto one of the neighboring villas. Somehow, I think that would make Al smile.
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Postby TMUhlmann on Fri May 25, 2007 3:57 am

Hmmm, I'm not sure where to begin jumping in on a movement to save the house that "can't be saved". That notion comes from a conclusion of the owner who had hoped to either integrate the house with the new construction; or move the house to another site. Mind you it was several years ago I read this. But I thought it rather odd that no one could figure out how to move the thing. Maybe they forgot to ask a SeaBee.

I also do not know who the current owner is or what about my take on the matter is accurate and not accurate. NEVERTHELESS, I am not totally without understanding. The suggestion to drop the house on one of the neighboring villas could be something of a bomb if you dropped it on OUR Beadle house. The sorry mess up the hill from 4918 White Gates Dr. is 5202 Saddle Rock Dr., the house I grew up in and came home to for 15 years after graduating from high school. After my mother died the house was sold to (if I am not mistaken) some attorneys. It was a poor time to sell on Camelback and so the once lovely and "pretentious" home was prey to bottom scrapers. And consider the indignities it had suffered. It's original pink and purple splendor (to match the Safari, my father's hotel) was dealt a death blow by the removal of lead from paints. No paint would be able to keep the depth of purple tint that made it so attractive in splendid moments of desert light.

Then I'm sorry to say the second indignity was brought about by my younger brother, a remodel freak who tore down the classy walls of Superlite block (O within a box....would that be [O][O][O]? Well you get the idea...) around the perimeter of the building's roof structure and replaced them with the current stucco, well, um, they look like shear panels. Ick.

Then my dear mom found the whole outside thing WAY too much to deal with, and the tiffgreen lawn, the grapefruit trees, the gorgeous Brahea armata Mexican Blue Palm, the saguaros. It began to look desolate. As it does to this day. Does anybody know what the !*#? is going on? Has the house been abandoned? At Christmastime I drove by and couldn't see anything that made me think anyone lived there.
You know, in one sense I agree with JRichard on the matter of letting them go. Not at all because of the houses not being structures worth living in or preserving because they are great houses. But they aren't the classic Al Beadle houses either. No one would (I hope) dare touch the Driggs house or the Patrick House for a teardown. But look at the neighborhood around our old house. The whole south side of Camelback in that area looks like the town that couldn't zone. Or something. Can't anybody get some building standards and guidelines in place to prevent the deterioration of once classy neighborhoods?

You can draw a straight line from 4918 through 5202 and then cross the street to Walter Bimson's house--and I don't know what the state of the house is there, but the driveway and streetside landscaping is heading south--and end up on the missing Davis house property. And of course up the hill on Cliffside Drive the Mendelson house is long gone. It was nearly identical to 4918. In all fairness there are some homes which are well taken care of and the area is lucky for that. But ever larger homes do not necessarily create enchantment which once was so evident.

[Gasp for breath...]

MrX, thank you for posting the 5202 pics. I will try to drum up some photos of the house when it was really slick. But we just didn't take pics of it for its own sake. I think also there's a Sun Living pic of it, possibly in the "Several Pretentious Homes Under Construction Here" article in the Gazette and that is referenced in "Constructions".
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